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Thursday, May 14, 2009

Need to keep our eyes open – Part II

Well, here is another great one.

Nationalised Banks in India generally offer the position of Security Officer to ex-service and Police Officers. As can be seen from this advertisement, usually the qualitative requirement for the said appointment for all banks is 5 years service as a Commissioned Officer or the same length of Group-A gazetted service as an Assistant Commandant / ASP or above from the Police side.

But my friends, here comes the clincher from UCO Bank. In this advertisement, they have sought Security Officers. But the requirement for the appointment is mentioned as an officer of the rank of Captain or equivalent with 5 years commissioned service from the military side or an Inspector from the Paramilitary etc with 5 years length of service. Yes, you saw that right. For the uninitiated, the post of an Inspector is equivalent to a Subedar of the Army.

Now who bells the cat and keeps a hawk-eye ?. As I opined in the last post on the same topic, it’s high time for the services headquarters to detail and incorporate a cell manned by qualified people to solely look into deputation, cross-employment and status issues vis-à-vis other departments and organisations, otherwise the future seems bleak.

22 comments:

Ramani said...

This is the sort of howler that is best ignored.Because if you were to see and analyse all the aberrations in various ads one is sure to go mad.
some of the advertisements defy all logic and gravity.

KK said...

The requirement is officer from AF with 5 years commissioned service or officer of rank NOT below Asst SP/Dy SP or equivalent from paramilitary forces and not Inspector( thank God ).However Asst SP and Dy SP are equivalent of Gp B.

julian said...

Rightly said Navdeep, I think the brand name of the defence service should not be allowed to deteriorate in such a manner. The Personnel already are suffering from a setback as far as esteem is concerned. By lowering our status further, the self esteem of the personnel will be adversely effected. The cell you suggested should immdtly take up the issue with the concerned bank / agency and take them to task and get the correction done.

Anonymous said...

i was reading a book on the debacle of Se La(chinese war of 1962)where it is written(in response to the study carried out as assessment of the causes etc of the war) that academic knowledge is useless if not supported by military or political will(power)

Anonymous said...

Army HQ should carry out a test to see what the IAS/IPS would do in such a case. Advt in prominent Newspapers for Retd offrs to Manage Central establishments. The Advt should say : Wanted Director - Administration for Station Central Services. Candidate should have retired from at least a Lt Col rank (or equivalent from the IAF and Navy)or should have held the Appointment of IG/JS in the civil services.
Let the Civil services react and then 'Do unto them what they do unto us'.

Harry said...

@ All

1. See how the seemingly similar looking rank badges (of Capt and Inspector, cloth strip notwithstanding!) can mislead people.

2. I REITERATE lets change our rk badges as follows:-



Hav - one star with cloth strip (Let him be Senior NCO only though and not JCO. If needed call him by another name).

Nb Sub - two stars with cloth strip.

Sub - Three stars with cloth strip.

SM - Ashoka with cloth strip (status quo)

2Lt - During training (and count training period and call him Trainee Lt if you will!)

Lt - Three stars( upon passing out, like IPS pass outs)

Capt - 4 year service( incl training) with Ashoka.(Equivalent to STS of civ service)

Maj - 9 year service (incl training) with Ashoka and star (akin to JAG Grade). Its minor loss of 1.5 year, as its 6 + 1.5 year presently.

Lt Col - 13 years (incl training) Ashoka with two stars and red collar tabs ( Incidently in Nepalese Army every officer wears red collar tabs, so much for the presumed importance of red collar tabs!!) Equate with Dir to GoI and CPO Comdts.

Col - 15 years service (incl training), equate with DIGs with similar rank badges and let them have one star on vehicles. Those who miss promotion to Col should get this rank automatically in 20 years

Brig - 20 year service, upgrade rank to Brig Gen and equate with IG Police and SAG of IAS. Rank badges be : One Star with cross sword n baton and two stars on vehicles.

Maj Gen - 25 year service, equate with HAG, Rank Badges: Ashoka with cross sword n baton with three stars on vehicles.

Lt Gen - 30 year service, equate with HAG+ Rank Badges: Ashoka with cross sword n baton and bayonet/dagger and 4 stars on vehicles.

Army Cdr/ Vice Chief - PSOs also to be given this Grade alongwith Army Cdrs/Vice Chief, they be called Col Gens and rank badges be suitably defined with 5 stars on vehicles.

Gen - No change, but Ashoka on vehicle.

Field Marshal - Sword n baton on vehicle.

Anonymous said...

My dear Navdeep, youe advice to services head quarters to detail and incorporate a cell manned by qualified people to solely look into deputation, cross-employment and status issues vis-à-vis other departments and organisations, seems to be alright but please tell me where does one approach when there is no parity of status among the officers within the services, Hope you are aware that one one hand chairman chiefs of staff commitee and CNS taken up the issue of parity of service officer with civilian officers and on other hand under the same person in Navy promotion to the rank of Caption TS on complition of 26 years of service by the Comander TS has not been implemented till date whereas Army and Air force has promoted there Lt col TS and Wing Cdr TS to the rank of COl TS and Gp Capt TS respectively on completion of 26 years. Under this circumstances do you think services has will to look after the welfare and status of the people that too when they are retiring and trying to get civil job ?

Anonymous said...

Similar openings for "Cheif Security Managers" also used to be advertised for with QR of Col & above. Will they ask for only ACP or DSP from Police ???

PANKAJ said...

Civilians are enjoying the best of both world. in MES they are enjoying all te facilities of ARMY and for lucrative appts like CE they are ready to work under Command CE with same Grade pay and are answerable to Sub Area Cdr who has lesser Grade pay. However when it comes to staff appt as Director (SE) in Zone or at Command they refuse to work under a Colonel with same Grade pay. this needs to be resolved at the earliest else MES will soon go out of Army's hand.

Aditya said...

Such problems cannot be resolved at the Service HQ level, though they can be monitored.

IMO, government needs to pass rules of business which make it mandatory for any PSU/Nationalised Bank/Govt. org. to circulate draft advertisements to the ibid service HQ cell mentioned by Navdeep for vetting, as regards equivalency and protocol.

That is the correct solution.

Anonymous said...

Why not..
(i) Write individual letters to the Chairman of the bank, pointing out the error and asking him to correct it.
(ii) Write a letter to the Military Secretary / Raksha Mantri pointing out the affront to our status and asking for the matter to be taken up with the Finance Ministry. GOI is the majority shareholder in the bank and can certainly fix responsibility for the error if it so wishes.
(iii) Buy just 1 share each in UCO Bank and wait for the Annual AGM. Then acting jointly as a section of minority shareholders, a group of us can ask for a discussion of this matter in the AGM. We could also draw a large amount of publicity for the matter thus ensuring that it would'nt be repeated.
(iv) Contact the manager of your nearest UCO Bank. Request him to open bank accounts for all the men in your unit.A prospect of acquiring a few hundred accounts in a day's work will certainly put a smile on his face! Shift all your public accounts to his branch too! Open FDs for large amounts ensuring that you become a favoured customer. Six months later, you and your men might not be happy with the services rendered by the bank. Perhaps you do not like waiting in line for inordinate periods (remember, RBI has laid down norms for service for all nationalized banks). Maybe the staff has been misbehaving with our men and their families...Raise merry hell, withdraw all the accounts, go to the press, file charges against them all, call in the regional manager, ask for redressal of all your ills. Mention prominently that the bank has a shady past history of treating the military man poorly. Accuse them of bias. Then,when they are ready to negotiate..ask for a public apology in all the national newspapers.
Take your pick but act...don't just dismiss it as just another poor show.
God helps those who help themselves!

Anonymous said...

dear navdeep less no of comments shows our attitude that is the reason we have been kicked every time the josh is just for some time and that results in not winning the bigger war thee is lot of inquiry regarding TS 21 year i would request a post on this from you and follow up

Regular said...

And the third subpara of the same ad says:

"iii) Any directly recruited Police Officer in the rank of Sub-Inspector who
is working with the Police Force for minimum 8 years in the
investigation cadre."

So there!

ANUPAM said...

of course it is high time....infact just a cell will not do the wonders...if possible it should make way to a compulsory check for any advertisement across the board in daily news papers which have any issue related to mention of ranks of the forces!!!

pawan said...

Dear Maj Navdeep,
We recommend legal action against the Chairman and the board of directors of the bank for deliberately degrading the status of armed forces so that in future anybody should think 100 times before taking such a stupid step.
We should also inform all the district soldier boards where these appointments are to be made to take appropriate measures against this bank in their area.

Anonymous said...

Thanks but there was nothing harsh in the comments except facts.

Beniwal said...

Yes, Its duty of service HQs to get the wrong corrected and ensure all civilians deptt.s get OK from service HQs before issuing ad. Its also the duty of KSB/DGR to take up this type of humiliation of ESM with one and all govt./PSUs/local bodies looking for ESM, to know the status of ESM for civil employment.

Ashwani Saini said...

I have been following your blog for sometime now. It's nice that you bought up this issue on your blog. This is an area which requires consideration from the right quarters. There have been instances where people from ranks have been promoted in the Bank security cadres.
Another aspect of the problem is that on many occassions these very people make it to the next grades in promotions superceeding the ex-service officers due to reservations.

Anonymous said...

@ALL...

IF I AM NOT INCORRECT THEN ALL ADVERTISEMENTS INCL TENDERS BY GOVT IN PRESS R ROUTED THROUGH A SINGLE AGENCY...PRESS TRUST OF INDIA OR SOME AGENCY LIKE THIS,

WHAT PERHAPS ARMY CAN DO IS THAT THROUGH GOVT CHANNELS A STANDING OPERATING PROCEDURE BE PUT IN PLACE WHERE IN ANY ADVERTISEMENT WHICH HAS ARMED FORCS/EX-ARMED FORCES RELATED CONTENTS BE SENT TO AG's BR WHICH DEALS WITH HONORS/AWARDS/STATUS ISSUES FOR VETTING AND IF AN AMBIGUITY IS FOUND THEN THE OBSERVATIONS BE RAISED AND THE ORIGINATOR MAY BE ASKED TO CORRECT.

THERE IS NO NEED FOR A SEPARATE CELL ,ONLY AN APPOINTMENT WILL DO.
THIS IS THE BEST WORKABLE SOLUTION UNDER THE EXISTING PROCEDURES.

Anonymous said...

@ Pankaj

Same is true for the service officer who are working in org like MES,DRDO,..etc.. enjoying all the perks of services and doing the job meant for civilians. The same job is been done by the civilian at nearly half of the salary.
For Lucrative post like CWE a Colone is ready to work with Director(Supdt Engineers) at same grae pay..but when he is posted in zone he wants to become ACE and wants all Director(SE) to report to him.

Anonymous said...

Why can't the ex-service men cell be tasked to be the media watch dog for all these kind of issues/ situations?

anuraag said...

it is actually disgusting to see the ranks of the esteemed defence forces officers fall to such a level.As per the goverment a section officer or head master or a lecturer should be treated like a gazeted officer but not an security officer in a nationalised bank.A security officer in a circle takes care of 3 to 5 districts as far of security in nationalised banks r concerned.Just imagine if the banks fail or some untoward incident happens in the nationalised banks,what will be its effect upon the economy and the moral of the citizens.For becoming a manager/officer in a bank a person has to clear a competative examination ,which is tougher than the state civil services.Yet, the government does not consider the bank officials as gazetted.This is really strange.Incase of any threat to the bank ,it is these people who face it first and then the police or civil administration.These men are trained to fight a war and are capable of handling any situation much better than the police.Incase the are treated os gazeted officers, it will act as a moral booster,they will be able to perform better and lower the responsibilities of the police.