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Thursday, June 11, 2009

Welcome Step : ECHS to issue medicines for 90 days for chronic ailments

The ECHS Central Organisation has decided to issue directions for release of medicines for a period of three months to patients suffering from chronic ailments since issuance of medication for shorter periods was causing hardship to patients who had to visit ECHS establishments time and again to get the same re-issued.

These instructions have been circulated vide Letter No B/49762/AG/ECHS dated 13 May 2009 and have been disseminated to all Commands (including IN & IAF).

53 comments:

Anonymous said...

ECHS need to be more user friendly.
1. ECHS cards may be usable as ATM card.Patient should be welcome to go to ECHS Ployclinic/M.H./ any empanneled facility directly on his own choice. Treatment , medicines etc should be available at the same place .
2. As of now, a patient has to make trips to ECHS Ployclinic first, then to specialist, then to ECHS Ployclinic, then to Empanneled facility, then back to ECHS PLoyclinic for any medicines(Generally medicines prescribed by empanneled facility doctors are not available with ECHS/MH)....in disgust and to save time,energy,money most patients buy the medicines from the market.
Thus the ECHS facility gets reduced to consultation only- that too costs trips to ECHS-MH-ECHS-Empanelled Facility...if one calculates the costs of these trips ,it sounds logical/better to directly consult a doctor of one's choice directly @ say Rs 100-200 only.
So what is the answer ??
Either scrap the ECHS or make it more user friendly.
Lt Col A K Jain

U P Mathur said...

There are restrictions of hospitals for Delhi NCR ECHS patients. Earlier they could get specialised treatment in any NCR hospital, now NOIDA patients are required to get specialised treatment only in NOIDA Hospitals and not Delhi, likewise for Gurgaon patients. Needless to say the expertise and facilities available for specialized treatment are better in Delhi hospitals. These restrictions should be done away with.
Going upto R&R from Noida can itself be a nightmare travelling and waiting for your turn/ just getting an appointment for a future available date.
U P Mathur

Lt Cdr Vikrant Malhan said...

Let us look at ECHS mechanism for all Officers of Armed Forces including SSC Officers as this would enable a wider spectrum covered and also act as a privelege to them.

naren said...

I am in agreement with Col Jain
The procedures at the ECHS needs to be streamlined to make it more user friendly.
An individual referred to an empanelled hospital for a cardiac consultation is asked for a treadmill test or an echo cardiography by the cardiologist. He has to come back to the ECHS clinic for getting the approval by the officer in charge, not with standing the fact that the distance between the two may be 75 kms !! Besides a whole day is spent again merely for getting an approval. Now again the patient is seen by the cardiologist and asked for an angioplasty. He needs to report back again to the ECHS clinic. His ordeal does not end there. His papers are prepared afresh to be sent to the SEMO (generally the CO of the local MH) after whose scrutiny it is sent to the Senior advisor in Cardiology at the higher center which may be a bigger MH or a CH. All this takes at least two months……. or more if the Sr Adv happens to be on leave ! Meanwhile the poor old man with all his cardiac problems makes several trips to the ECHS clinic to find out about the “progress” of his case. Ultimately if the patient survives all this ordeal and delay, he gets to undergo the procedure at the empanelled Hospital.

The behaviour of the staff including doctors at many of these ECHS clinics leaves much to be desired. Perhaps it is indicative of the the low salary that they are paid. An MO is paid 15000 and a physician 25000. (which I believe is under revision). Many of these clinics are unable to get doctors because of this !

ECHS needs a lot more to do look after veterans in the evening of their lives.

A B Mehta said...

above comments are very timely as all of us, particularly elder and chronic patients, have to spend time, money for travels and above all extream inconvenience in summer and winter. All do not have cars or are not in a position to drive long distances in heavy traffic. The polyclinics are in Mil areas while vast majority live away or in sattelite towns. The PBORs suffer much more.
The rules of ECHS have been made like this simply to avoid being misused by a few. The vast majority usually has to suffer for these elements who in any case find a way around!
A way has to be found to make ECHS more friendly, efficient and less cumbersome.

Anonymous said...

I humbly suggest --
Medical care of ESM & families be entrusted with AMC.
Let all staff/funds earmearked for ECHS be entrusted with AMC.
Local /Nearest M.H./Medical authorities be made responsible to run mobile /stationary M.I.Rooms at distant places like AWDs by EME or Fd.Ambulance by AMC.
ESMs care will probably be better managed.
No amount of better compensation for ECHS staff is going to improve/ bring facilities at par with already existing & well established infrastructure of AMC
Lt Col A K Jain

Anonymous said...

The policy of issue of 90 Days medicine was earlier issued vide http://www.indianarmy.gov.in/echs/policy/medical/ISSUE%20OF%20MEDICNES%20TO%20ECHA%20BENIFICIARIES.htm. But was not implemented by ECHS.

Anonymous said...

I agree with Col Jain. Augment the existing AMC infrastructure esp paramedical staff, MOs, eqpt, bldgs. This can be done easily.
Currently the MHs are understaffed and undereqpt'd.
ECHS is just another monolith we are creating and will be unmanageable very soon.

Anonymous said...

Dear Navdeep,

Thanks for the update. You are simply superb. Keep up the good work.

Thanks

Medical Specialist said...

dear Lt Col Jain i am replying to your question..

do u have any idea what benefit our ECHS members have by utilizing this scheme. they get best of treatment and in some cases each patient treatment cost Org almost 2-3 lac if they go for angiography..(and quite a sizable number) i think we get so use to getting things free of cost that u feel the travel cost of 100 rs a big burden too!!!!

we are so so ....sooooo much oriented towards free services that even for adult diaper (chaddi) also one person was arguing with me that it should be provided free of cost.....

when will we learn to be positive about what organization is doing for us.

And by the way these trip which u say are meant for checks and balances to avoid unnessary escalated bills and to provide appropriate treatment to u.. we browse the documents and check the treatments given to these veterans. u will be surprised about the amount of advantage these pvt hospitals take since they know it is not the indl but the govt who is footing the bill.

Anonymous said...

@Med spl 7.23 11 Jun

I think this taunt of free services is misplaced. Medical care of Veterans is state responsibility and includes Geriatric care.

I regret to note that these comments are highly unprofessional...

Anonymous said...

I would like to say that pl judge ECHS by its user friendlyness and the user to be considered is that poor widow of a soldier living in a rural area . Is ECHS is really helping her . As per me is a big NO. Echs is definitely not user friendly and a lot is required to be done to make it user friendly .
This should be our Ex-service persons urgent priority.

Anonymous said...

The comments of Medical Specialist @ June 11, 2009 7:23 PM are indeed unfortunate.

But I guess this is the attitude of the AMC doctors in general - that they are doing a great big favour to everyone in the Indian Army.

And all the others are just beneficiaries !!!

Doctor said...

I will agree with Med Specialist about the ECHS being a very beneficial scheme. I have seen both the MH/CH set up and ECHS empanelled tertiary care hospitals, having worked in both set ups. I agree that ECHS patients have to run around more often than desirable, but this is due to the fact that empanelled hospitals have tended to misuse the carte blanche which was given to them earlier. To prevent hospitals from performing unnecessary tests, hospitals are required to get pre-authorization for tests costing more than a particular amount. This means extra trips for the ECHS veteran or his relative.
However I must point out that pre-authorization is the norm for ALL patients who have insurance cover from any private or public sector insurer providing cashless transaction (like ECHS). Moreover there is NO insurer who does not have a maximum limit (usually 2 lakhs to 4 lakhs maximum) on expenditure other than ECHS. Hence without checks and balances ECHS misuse will be on an unimaginable scale.
Moreover private insurance companies have doctors specializing in pre-approval procedures who are conversant with tests and procedures required for each condition (like angioplasty or cancer treatment). ECHS has no such expertise and has to rely on senior advisors and service super-specialists for opinion.
The ECHS is likely to get MORE and not LESS stringent on pre-authorization procedures in future due to continuing abuse of existing procedures by empanelled hospitals. The solution lies in making pre-authorization more easier by using methods like Electronic health records for documentation and transmission of ECHS members records to approving authorities.
And yes, even I have encountered many patients who absolutely refuse to pay even a couple of hundred rupees for sundry expenses while availing treatment worth lakhs from the ECHS.
And finally, while one can expect primary care to be provided close to one’s home, secondary and especially tertiary care can only be provided in big cities and people have to be prepared to travel for that.

Anonymous said...

@Med spl 7.23 11 Jun

you are probably a serving fauji doctor. Once you become an Ex-fauji you will realise the problems faced by them.The vast majority of ex servicemen and their widows have not benefitted much from ECHS because of their non user friendly attitude. The real beneficiaries are the people residing in big cities like Delhi, Bombay, Pune etc, What about the vast majority staying in the far flung villages?

About adult diapers, if they are entitled to get it what is wrong if they demand for it? Please understand the pain of a man who has has the unfortunate ailment because of which he needs to use adult diapers !

I am afraid you are out of touch with reality.

Anonymous said...

@Med Speciloast and @Med: First of all let me clarfiy that ECHS is not at all free gift/facility given. It is in exchange of Govt contract at the time of recruitment and the youth of a soldier he gives to service who is thrown out in the early fourties. This is not at all a free gift. Problem with our defence officers (mostly) are that they are always trying to cut their own people benefits. So people have to grow and come out of it so called free gift. I would pray God that almighty should not give any ailment to any one so that this so called free gift is not required by anyone. And those who are advocating for this should utilise this free gift.

Anonymous said...

I am an ex- AMC doctor and presently an "ex- serviceman" and an echs "beneficiary".
The unfortunate comments by two of the young doctors above reflect the negative attitude of a vast majority of the AMC doctors....the problems faced by old people with ailments to gether with other problems that come with old age, are difficult to appreciate unless you reach that stage yourself....but then the damage is already done.
Please understand that every one has to retire one day and ultimately become an exserviceman !

Anonymous said...

We need to share ideas for improvement of services like ECHS.
There is no point in casting any aspersions on serving AMC doctors.
Fact remains that all serving personnels have to attain the status of ESM.
All serving AMC or non-AMC personnel need to take pride in taking care of their elders (ESM).
I suggest that the enviornment discuss ideas for improvement of services of ECHS.
One such idea has been suggested by me is for entrusting medical care of ESMs also to DGAFMS...
Hope to see some more comments for /against it.
With the comments,it is evident that most of us are quite dissatisfied with ECHS in present form.
Lt Col A K Jain

Anonymous said...

@ Medical specialist

Please get out of this mindset that you are providing medical facility to ex-servicemen for free or doing a favour.He has served long enough to have earned this facility for life.

You are correct when you say that checks and balances need to be there to ensure that pvt hospitals don't misuse this to make money but in this age of technology you don't need to make the patient run around for getting sanctions.The ECHS card is a smart card with a chip on it.Why not keep a record of the patients medical history and all the test reports in a digitized form on the card itself & also there will be a copy of this on the ECHS server also.The hospitals should be asked to make online request to ECHS for the required tests & the specialist can have a look on the digitized reports & can decide whether the tests are actually required or not.
Don't know about the adult diaper but there is one thing I would suggest for ECHS to include is Air bubble mattress for paralysis patients to prevent bedsores.
ECHS is a good scheme but it needs to be fine tuned.I see that even in cases where facilities are available in the service hospitals even then ECHS patients are referred to private hospitals for tests.I saw a neuro specialist at a Command Hospital asking a Jawan's wife to get the MRI done at the empaneled hospital & then claim reimbursement from ECHS even when MRI was available at the Command Hospital?????Before ECHS happened he would have simply sent her to Command Hospital MRI centre.

MBG said...

My God! The Medical specialist & the doctor sound like the typical "Babu". God help our country if even Service Officers start sounding like them. I hope that they just sound like them & not act like them in their day to day performance of duties.

medical specialist said...

well i have been seeing the comments directed at me...some positive and some negative

i am a medical specialist and have retired recently in 2007, and i have seen both of service and ESM status.

i am quite well placed and lot of senior people consult me so i was telling out of my experience that by large when it comes to herd mentality of people vs AMC they leave no stone unturned to point finger at it since its a services oriented job some get satisfied some dont get satisfied but when i meet people as a individual they are extremely courteous.

what we should understand is the pvt hospitals have mis utilizing the ECHS scheme and have started producing escated bills a surgery which should cost 10000 is being charged as 25000 and unnessary minor ailments are added to the summary nd even evaluaton is done for it which would not have been warranted otherwise. and it is not a matter of just thousands or lacs for each medium size station it is touching few crores now.

what started as a nice gesture from govt is turning out as a difficult venture now due to cost involved so there is a requirement for rationalizing the unnecessary cost.. (i am saying about the unnecessary cost only which these pvt hospital do and not the genuine cost involved in treatment) .

ECHS scheme is being monitored by stn cdr but since he has no knowledge about medical data generated in case summaries the job is entrusted to SEMO (CO HOSPITAL)and being a responible army officer it is his job to ensure that money alloted to echs is put to judicious use and not just flaunted unnecessary. gradually we to learned what fraud these hospital can do. they use to put angiography report of false patients and use to do unnessary procedures for ECHS benifeciaries so we started sking for actual CDs to see if procedure is really required or not and for that the documents have to go to cardiologist who has knowlege to do it.

these things happen since we dont consider ECHS as a benifit extended to us we just sign blindly what ever the hospital tells us to sign since we are in agony at the time of treatment and later on they fill up false bills.

Lt col jain i am sure u will understand checks are a necessity which we should learn to respect.
in case of emergency the hospital are permitted to carry out the procedure but now they are misusing this also now a simple planned procedure is carried out as emergency.

medical specialist said...

dear MBG

its so easy to put a taunt since u dont understand the intricacy of a AMC or ECHS..

tell me do i have authority of talking about t90 or a M1 Abrams tanks and why we cant get better tanks then t90 which is causing injuries to our beloved soldier ears due to gun power.. why cant we have m1 abrams which is computerized and sofesticated...

well the answer is simple we as doctors dont talk on things which we dont know or authorized to talk about. but i see a lot of army officers behaving as half doctors.

Anonymous said...

here is a blog on echs including that of the peri patetic (? peri pathetic) state of affairs

http://reportmysignal.blogspot.com/2008/11/echs-and-its-present-pitfalls.html

MBG said...

Dear Medical Specialist,
I meant no taunt. It was my anguished comment.
No, I am not a medical person but having spent over 40 years in uniform, I have a smattering of knowledge of what makes the Armed Forces tick. A system which compels veterans to run from pillar to post fo medical needs is not one of them.
Without getting too technical, I suggest an examination of how CGHS works & how little running around the patients are required to do. To my mind, that should be the essence of ECHS functioning.

Anonymous said...

Dear Medical Specialist,

Some of the bloggers thought that u are a youngster from AMC fraternity. Therefore there is a need to do the introspection as to why they thought that way. However I am afraid this u may not be able to do it.

The immaturity certainly reflects (after you yourself revealing your age) that u are suffering from de- generation. I would suggest the well wishers of this med spl to take him to some good neuro- physician/neurologist for immediate check up. The process of de generation cannot be stopped but certainly can be delayed(to the extent of 12 -15 yrs) with right medication.

I pray almighty to cure u on fast track. Best wishes.

Dear All,

AGE DOES NOT MAKE US 'BIG/IMPORTANT/GREAT' AND EARN US RESPECT. IT IS ONLY THE WAY WE THINK MAKE US BIG /IMPORTANT /GREAT AND EARN US RESPECT. IN NUTSHELL IT IS ONLY 'SOCH'/THOUGHT PROCESS MATTERS.

BEST WISHES

Doctor said...

I am sorry that MBG and some others consider measures suggested to prevent misuse of ECHS by private hospitals as falling in the realm of “Babu “like attitude.
I think that everybody should remember that ECHS is not a “free” service. The bill is being footed by someone (The Govt of India/Taxpayer in this case). If checks and balances are not enforced, the scheme will die its natural death as no government will be able to afford it in the long run.
Smooth running of the ECHS scheme is the responsibility of the executive cadre, which is being manned by officers (serving and retired) of the administrative (non-medical) branch. So it is unfair to lay the blame on doctors for all ills plaguing the scheme. No doctor will EVER want his patient running around for administrative sanctions.
Asking DGAFMS or AMC to manage ECHS is not a solution either as one of the reasons for establishing ECHS was to decrease the workload on service hospitals which are understaffed in any case.
We can look at schemes like Veterans Health Administration of the United States as a model to follow.
But all this will require money, more professionals (Doctors, Paramedical staff and hospital administrators) and management by people who are experienced in running healthcare related projects.
For first world care, we need first world budget and resources.

Anonymous said...

Checks and balances are essential.
Systems and procedures need to be generated such that they do not tax the ultimate purpose itself.
For secondary,tertiary medical care ,the patient has to travel to such nodal places , where the facilities are available.
For ECHS , we have made such procedures that even being in a state capital,making use of ECHS services is quite uneconomical,painful and disgusting.
I consider it more economical and convenient to consult best known specialist and buy medicines prescribed from the market at my own cost and approach ECHS only if some costly tests /procedures are involved.
I consider it right to make health care of ESM so user friendly that one should only think of own facilities.
To that aim,I feel- what can be better than to continue having same medical care as we had been getting while in service.In other words, I advocate augumenting the existing services medical infrastructure and entrust ESM care also to them.
Lt Col A K Jain

bobby said...

- It was with bated breath and trepidation I was watching the healthy and not so healthy exchange of ideas and thoughts between and the beneficiaries of AMC. Well I am not trying to play the Devil’s advocate. But sometimes I wonder why people never complain when years after years the ration we get are substandard befitting to be thrown into a garbage can or eaten by dogs and cows. I also wonder why people never complain about the cars, ambulances and medical equipments going for repair to the workshops, inadavertently delayed, never repaired or come back in one piece. Why do people never complain about the state of MES (they get away with murder) or the measley signals telephone(supposed to provide, internet, mobile telephony worth 1500/.)
- Nowing coming back to AMC, there cannot be smoke without a fire. We doctors are sometimes at fault, maybe because paucity of manpower, lack of proper infrastructure, or a busy OPD sometimes a nagging wife or child takes its toll when dealing with an average of one hundred people per day.
- Because unlike other arms, we are not only trying to serve the brave officers who have given their youth to the nation ( so have we) but also their authorized and unauthorized dependants while in service and also long after they have retired.My parents always has to keep a hefty sum aside for their mediclaim which I think no one of us has to even bother about.
- I am also appalled ,is AMC bashing part of some curriculum?.From senior officers to fledgling new born officers, the attitude towards AMC is the same.Whenever you can, in whatever way you can, bash them because my father once said-people always bite the hand that helps you and lick the boot that kicks you.
- I think Lt Col Jain is out of touch with reality. A mere Rs100/ will only get you a consultation from a RMP doctor,leave alone the inv costs and medicines, I think ashort trip to MH will save him at least Rs 1000/ for even a innocuous URTI .I think AMC is shortstaffed to provide a mobile specialist van to deliver consultation and medicines at doorstep.
- After seeing ECHS, one is appalled at the treatment protocols followed. I am glad that I have been trained at a premier institution called AFMC where our foundation as a doctor is so strong that we would not be able to have a goodnight sleep if we practice such dustbin,unethical,medicine and protocol.And I am sure that like all other good schemes it will die its own untimely death due to multifactorial reasons ranging from greedy private institutions( we pay their taxes), our simple clientele for whom the glitterati of a corporate hospital scores over the ethical practice of a well run govt hospital( that’s what MH is) .As a result they give informed and non-informed consent to a host of costly and totally unwarranted procedures as long as they do not have to dive into their own pockets, but someone out there is diving deep to empty the coffers.
- Lets us face, I am not complaining from a doctor’s point of view(we are not suppose to complain) as to how an officer should leave his rank behind when he walks into a hospital or stop treating as part of their sahahayak party or--------------.
- But one thing I know for sure, the day I finish my twenty years , I will hang my uniform to lead a private practitioners life and I know my medical education never came for free, then why should my consultation come for free, especially for the peanuts the governmrnt is paying to me. Till then lets not crib. Have a nice weekend.

Anonymous said...

Will some body see these comments to know what the ex-servicemen feel about the ECHS scheme . And mind you poor ex-servicemen ( including poor widows ) living in rural areas have not contributed to this debate .
The ECHS scheme positively needs a drastic change to make it more user friendly . Checks and balances are just procedures and in India despite of a large amount of checks and balances installed by bureaucracy there is such a lot of corruption in every dept . Checks and balances are tools in the hands of BABUS to show their power and also for their corrupt practices .
The motto of ECHS should be that not a single person is delayed and made to run around to get medical care . It should be as simple as going to a doctor privately. .

Anonymous said...

The Medical care of Veterans is a State responsibility and ECHS is only a delivery mechanism. Now, if there are leakages and power games being played - that's a delivery problem of the State. I feel MoD (in turn leading down to AMC) should only restrict their working to being regulators (like say TRAI) and Quality checks. Mixing functions of operating ECHS as well as being policy makers is somehow spoiling the show.

Besides, there could be a IT backbone (with web access) for all ECHS members -so, that one could log in for approvals. Lets go by the assessment that Internet access is fairly high even with post retirement Jawans in remote areas. Also malpractices at the Hospitals should be widely circulated - again to all members; as case studies. This would bring refinement and better awareness. I don't see how the Governement can look the other way, when there's a serious trouble formenting in the Healthcare delivery mechanism to the Nation's veteran fraternity....

Anonymous said...

The echs needs to be made more user friendly. I am not saying this because the beneficiaries are some kind of VIPs…..they are poor old soldiers and their widows. They need to be looked after….please don’t make them run around from pillar to post for getting approvals of each and every investigation….besides, are these approving authorities, carrying out any audit? I am afraid not. The clerk just puts it up for signature and it is just signed ! Why can’t we make use of modern technology to simplify things? Why can’t the smart card made “smarter” incorporating new features?

Yes, misuse and inflated bills by the corporate hospitals need to be prevented. But is it being done now? I am yet to see a case where the approving authority overrules the investigation asked for by a civil consultant. Besides why are the corp hospitals inflating the bills? Their payments from the ECHS are delayed by months! Corporate Hospitals are providing excellent healthcare. …but they are also running a business organization….they need prompt payments. If these hospitals are over charging, why can’t the echs blacklist them? More often than not, It is the other way round. It is some of these hospitals which have “blacklisted” the echs and refused to provide any more services because of payments long over due.

The organization needs to device mechanisms to rectify these problems but certainly not by making that poor ex-soldier or widow nun around in circles.

Anonymous said...

I agree at times the private hospitals charge extra but as per me that is to make up for loss to them because of the delays in payment . And overcharging may even be because they paid heavily to get themselves empanelled . And at times not empanelling some good hospitals may be because those hospitals refuse to pay the cut that is asked for.
ECHS has to function in a open , transparent and also in a way which is more user friendly ( to the last person in the chain ). Like it is said in judiciary that let any number of crooks get away but not a single innocent person is hanged . So do not let a single person suffer because of procedural hassles of ECHS . Lets not be penny wise and pound foolish .And rightly said health - care post retirement is our right , which we have earned ; and that too a hassle free healt-care

Anonymous said...

Now 90 days medicine 4 chronic patients pure wastage of medicines . Who will monitor the sideaffects of medicines simple things like blood pressure, Diabetic fluctuate in old age. but

Anonymous said...

people have a coplaint regarding service hospitals comparing them wit corporate hospitals please compare ur facility with things at govt. hospitals we r much much better in providing services but level of satisfaction is not there . AMC is still working with sme manpower with almost more than 100% increase in patient load .

Anonymous said...

i have been reading comments of people against AMC . people dont want AMC to be professional. i suggest AMC to be made a medical execuetuic force under defence services with no control by army in peace . Ya in field same setup can exist this will solve many problems . NO one make comments on other arms after retiring they only can target hospitals

Anonymous said...

In my view the comments for and against the amc is not the issue. we must positively try to improve the procedures to cause minimum inconvenience to the patients.some suggesions like centralised server to obtain approvals online shud b imlemented on priority.
sanction to issue 90 days is welcome but implementing is a problem as medicines for common chronic diseases like BP AND DIABATESE are not available in one visit,correct information regardind availability is not given on tele.In AFC lodhi road the guy inside the dispensary has been imprisoned in glass room wherein niether the patient or the vendor can hear each other.wrong and disproportionate medicines r given which the patient realises only on reaching home.
careful utilisation of what we have will go a long way in making echs userfriendly.

lt col (retd) m.s.bedi said...

Let it be very clear that service conditions clearly state that medical facilities will b provided yo all defence personnel serving or retired.Where is the question of cost envolved.Do we have to accept that we do not have the management capacity to organise the echs.We should pose this promlem to number of IIMs in our country where fortunately foujis have done well.
we seem to give last priority to the comfort of the patient whose health deteriorates by running from pillar to post.
the other important factor is that we cannot afford medical costs in civil as our salaries thruout the service did not give enough to cater for medical in later years of life.
Do we have to resort to returning our medals for this.

Anonymous said...

I think this is not the matter of retunring medals as staed by gentleman. all hospitals were intially started for serving and dependant only. hospitals cannot shred the responsibility of looking after their own people but the govt. wants the hopitals to run on same PE as after independance.Forget IIM they have learnt from fauji,s art of man managment eveything projected returned from MOD. imagine no. of wards , paramedic , specialist are same with dependants and populationsincreasing. R we stretching the rubberband to the point of breakdown. let us think with cool minds afterall this is our organisation let us solve it ourselves

lt col(retd) m s bedi said...

with due respect to the anonymous PE does not effect the administrative methodology.. we can not provide proper reception,waiting rooms,privacy to patients while being examined.receptionist cannot write your name properly,people keep rushing in and out of clinics,they try to jump the que and sometimes doctors show fovours by entertaining their acquaintances.these are aspects which can be improved without increase in PE.we could learn from private clinics and private hosps.

Anonymous said...

Yes why not. the system should be same as a patien t for all ranks as in other hospitals. everbody should be in a Q irrespective of rank they hold. doctors r being blamed but system is such people through their weight for treatment not realising the ones who r waiting r part of their own troops.I respect your remarks but sorry people do this whenever u vissit hospital but the doctor is put under pressure to see even if he does not want by people whom ,themselves exists as a primary issue with no concern 4 other patients who R waiting. I remember my friend seeing a serious patient and a retired senior officer complained not being given Dispirin. well this is the very sorry affair of sysstem, but the people who r actually affected cannot even complaint. sorry Col bedi sir u r seeing system from ur point of view think of a ex sepoy who suffers daily because a retired /senior officer break the Q to see the doctor and he sits mum waiting for his turn. do we have PE 4 such people .

bedi said...

we admire the constraints that the docs are working but to my mind when inside a clinic doc is the boss he should shoo away any person senior or junior,general or sepoy if he /she tries to enter out of turn.Privacy of the patient has to be honoured,nobody enters a OT if a surgery is in progress.As it is most of the docs dont have time to answer patients queries imagine if he is interrupted time and again.
These r the systems that do not require funds/PE and can b improved by enforcement specialy in the services where individuals are obedient and adhere to procedures.

Anonymous said...

Thanks sir. i respect ur comments. But sometimes ur r really stuck up on this issues. but people like u still exists who make the system survive .

Anonymous said...

ECHS can provide better cover to ESM if--
Existing MI Rooms , MH etc accept ESM
ECHS ployclinics MUST be co-located and under command of MH
MH allowed to send the ESM to empanelled hopital.
Station HQ etc are taken off the duty for ECHS.
Some positive change in attitude of medical officers--
a small example of negativity is USG / taking blood samples on empty stomach which could be managed at early hours.

Anonymous said...

near by SSQ or MI room may be permitted to attend Ex service personal of defence as most of the ECHS are far way specially in rural area

Anonymous said...

Sir,
can we visit any echs polyclinic or only specified in card

Anonymous said...

I have failed to understand as to how pension becomes the major criterion to avail of ECHS facilities (unless you are invalidated or disabled and the same is Attributable to service).

What crime has a SSCO or ECO done and for that matter anybody who has served the armed forces within the framework of its rules for not being authorised to avail such a facility. As per current regs an officer with 19 years and 364 days of service may not be enough but after the 365th day, you are "pensionable" and - bingo- you are a veteran and can avail of all facilities. Is'nt it time that this anamoly is corrected. Appreciate your views

Mr Usanath maitra said...

From: Usanath Maitra,Ex MCPO2 No.057206R
Sir,
I would like to say that I am from Kalyan,Maharashtra, dist. Thane, and my polyclinic is in Kanjurimarg which is about 40 kms from my house. I am a heart patient and I go to Aswini for Cardiologist, For that I start from home at morning 5'o colck and my turn comes to doctor at 1300hrs. Then I have to come to kanjurimarg for medicine as it is not given by ASWINI. now suppose if I do not get one of the medicine in the polyclinic(Kanjurimarg), then again I have to go to Aswini to collect. If that particular medicine is not available even in
Aswini also, then Aswini will raise the requisation for local purchase . So again after 2/3 days, I have to go to the Aswini to collect the medicine. These total cycle is a horrible for me and I get more sick. So it is requested that those who are going to Aswini for specialist, medicine should be given in Aswini only.

usanath maitra said...

From: Usanath Maitra, Ex MCPO2,NO.057206R.

Sir, I am staying in Kalyan,Dist.Thane,Maharashtra. Our polyclinic in Kanjurimarg which is about 40 Kms away from Kalyan. I am a heart patient and every month I have to go to collect the medicine from there after checking cardiologist(if require) at Aswini.
In Kalyan (including Dombivli,Sahad,Ullhasnagar,Titwala,Badlapur etc.) arround more than 5000 exserviceman are staying. So it is requested that if any polyclinic or empanalled hospital is arrenged in kalyan, where exserviceman can go for medical check up as echs polyclinic, then it will be highly appreciated by us. I belive that our echs organisation will consider this sugession and do the needful.
Thanks and regards to the ECHS organisation.

Anonymous said...

Having confronted with the ECHS trauma in first person, I have one thing to say that the procedures set out in the guise of checks and balances is ridiculously primitive and unprofessional. After my retirement, I never cared to go to a Service Hospital for any favour b'coz I knew well it was a criminal waste of time and it would serve just one purpose ie. to remind myself that I was a low rank ex-service man who could be subjected to all the foolish nuances of sick parade. The situation is still the same in ECHS. The scheme is badly in need of 'modernization'. Let it be run as an insurance scheme rather than an extended hand of service hospitals. Making the patients pillar to post is not the way to check escalation of bills by empanelled hospitals. Consult some good insurance companies! they would teach u how is done.

Anonymous said...

can someone share their experience with the private insurers who claim to provide cashless mediclaim so that it can be compared with the ECHS scheme.

regards

PATIL BABAJI GOPAL said...

I think there is no time limit to the membership in ECHS because of many more Ex-servicemen are residing in remote arrears and they are till unknown about ECSH and whereas still they reporting to private and civil government hospitals on sick. Therefore, you are requested to extend the period of registration of ECHS for these Ex-servicemen please. I hope competent authorities will be consider same and will make wide broad cost in the news papers and radio stations of India please.

Anonymous said...

SIR,
I would like to inform all of you that the medicine for three month in chronic cases is not issued by echs even after order. please order the echs to issue medicine in chronic cases for three months where no conseltation is needed.

Anonymous said...

ECHS is probably the best medical service provided to Veterans any where in the world.
In fact it too open ended and sooner or later the finances will dictate the restrictions rather than the gripes and counter points.
That it is used as a cash cow by corporate hospitals is undoubted.
It is oriented to urban areas as medical care in the country is practically 80% in urban areas.
The scheme was poorly thought out and hence the changes. The problems that would occur were evident at start but instead of addressing them the scheme was pushed through. The limitations of infrastructure, demographics, resources, bad practices in civil and many other are apparent. The moon was promised and expectations raised beyond deliverable means.
there are solutions which would need the veterans and the ECHS to find common ground, needs too much space to elucidate. Lets keep this great scheme going.