tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post4034160081666548935..comments2024-02-08T22:01:40.101+05:30Comments on Indian Military : Service Benefits and Issues: The elusive solution !!! Where is it ?Navdeep / Maj Navdeep Singhhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11481215977936848477noreply@blogger.comBlogger48125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-53427986761333897882010-01-20T20:53:34.215+05:302010-01-20T20:53:34.215+05:30there is sheet with revised grade pay being circul...there is sheet with revised grade pay being circulated. Any truth to the contents??? 13 yrs - 8700, 14-17 yrs 8900, 18 yrs 10000.????Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-43823858045870246862010-01-04T11:23:20.197+05:302010-01-04T11:23:20.197+05:30Some headway seen , COL TS in 21
yrs
SSSome headway seen , COL TS in 21<br />yrs <br />SSSSnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-68978539181165423852010-01-04T10:34:11.905+05:302010-01-04T10:34:11.905+05:30In Army Medical Corps, the Col board is presently ...In Army Medical Corps, the Col board is presently at 21-22 yrs vis-a vis 15 yrs for Infantry.Col TS at 18 yrs will atleast help AMC tremendously, as DACP is a distant dream now.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-74037894907312217632010-01-04T00:54:03.133+05:302010-01-04T00:54:03.133+05:30Anony dec 31/0857 pm has analyzed the situation ve...Anony dec 31/0857 pm has analyzed the situation very well and similar thing has happened in IAF also. <br /><br />Not with standing col ts must be reduced to 21 yrs so that after a few years offrs of services branch(considred at 18) after missing three boards would automatically be picking up col ts. <br /><br />as for as the officers of presently having =>21 yrs and not permanently passed over would be col s if selected by the board otherwise in any case they would RETIRE AS COL TS ONLY.<br /><br />it is fair deal for all after reducing col substantive rank from 20 to 15.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-33273935815651585462009-12-31T20:57:35.698+05:302009-12-31T20:57:35.698+05:30I do not think the 18 yr time scale rank for promo...I do not think the 18 yr time scale rank for promotion to Col i going to materialise. What has happened after implementation of AVS Phase 2 is that most of the addl vac in the army at full col level have gone to the fighting arms: next to none to the services.The result is that result is that sucess rate of services in No 3 board is coming down to 30 percent or therebouts.This fig can be maint only if boards for fighting arms and servuices are held 5 yrs apart for the same batch. If the diff has to be maint at 3 yrs then sucess rates will have to come down to the region of 22 percent.Assuming that the org would like to maint the sucess rate of services in no 3 board at 30 percent , this would result in services officers facing their first boards with abt 20 yrs of service. If this is the case, the prospect of picking up Col (TS) with 18 yrs of service would result in the absurd situation of services officers picking up TS rank even before facing No 3 board. So , as I see it we can have Col (TS) at 18 yrs coming in only if there is concensus on bringing down success rates of services to 22 percent. The other option, of course is to redistribute some of the AVS Phase 2 vac to services as well, which in turn means that results for fighting arms which are now in the region of 55-60 percent will come down. Its a difficult choice to make at the top: lets see how the cookie will crumble.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-43056478750379355872009-12-31T09:38:35.529+05:302009-12-31T09:38:35.529+05:30Happy New year to all. Hope to get some good NEWS ...Happy New year to all. Hope to get some good NEWS exclusively for Armed Forces.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-70707790232752537462009-12-30T22:42:56.269+05:302009-12-30T22:42:56.269+05:30I THINK THE debate has going useless. the thinking...I THINK THE debate has going useless. the thinking among many defence officers that gp A services are way ahead from them is factually not correct . <br />i my self in EE NFSG post even after about 20 years whers as lt col is granted in 13 years . this is the posn in majority of gp A services. every where the promotion r vacancy based . only in very select GP A sevices such as IAS , IFS , IPS etc the promotions r faster than defence services . <br />things can not improve by comparing with civil , but the solution has to come from with in defence services .<br /><br />like AVSE report provided much relief .mukeshnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-90982573569104193912009-12-28T12:22:25.524+05:302009-12-28T12:22:25.524+05:30Every other Gp 'A' services has gone ahead...Every other Gp 'A' services has gone ahead much more than Defence Services. This Pay commission is the biggest damager. The anamolies which were pointed out last year are not even talked about any more. I still feel that it is the MSP which which has not gone down the gullet of so called decision makers. Lets give back the MSP but should be given back the same status, Pay and promotional avenues. It's just the recession which has given false scenario that people are again getting attracted toward Def Forces. Selection In SSB's has not really gone up because only the quantity has increased not the quality. Maj Navdeep no doubt has done tremendous job for the cause of Def Services and we sincerely want him to continue this fight till logical conclusion.<br />AmenSatishnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-29789061458369636952009-12-26T17:26:00.683+05:302009-12-26T17:26:00.683+05:30Dear Maj Navdeep
I have no doubt that you were ar...Dear Maj Navdeep<br /> I have no doubt that you were are and will remain in our side<br /> In fact service never have a better voice with you<br />However I strongly feel that root cause to solve the problem is to have some sort of parity with organised Group A services<br />We all know services cant live and work wothout a rank structure<br />As such we have to have a solution more or less based on your earlier post but with a rank progression to COL in 18 yrs <br />We can have selection garde but should ensure that almost all rech this level by 18 /19 yrs as the case is presently with other GP A services<br /> Similarly BRIG rank selection should be made with an aim to ensure that every one retires atleast at BRIG rank as already stipulated in AVSC Report<br />pAY SHOULD IN CASE BE PROTECTED AND SHOULD BE GIVEN AT PAR WITH gP A Services<br />RajivNewkidnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-6537900331130312192009-12-25T17:01:16.865+05:302009-12-25T17:01:16.865+05:30@Satish
Neither has the govt offered the rk of fu...@Satish<br /><br />Neither has the govt offered the rk of full Col in 18 yrs and resultantly nor have the service HQrs rejected any such demand. This rumour is an off-shoot of some fertile minds. Please go through the scribd document in the post in depth before commenting on the 'side' I am on.Navdeep / Maj Navdeep Singhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11481215977936848477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-58479245421839400842009-12-25T15:08:33.037+05:302009-12-25T15:08:33.037+05:30YES I FULLY AGREE WITH RAJ AND IT IS ALSO BECOMING...YES I FULLY AGREE WITH RAJ AND IT IS ALSO BECOMING CLEAR THAT MAJOR NAVDEEP WHO TILL NOW WAS ON OUR SIDE,SEEMS TO BE SHIFTING TO THE OTHER SIDE. I DON'T KNOW THE REASON. 18 YEARS IS REASONABLE AND GOI IS GIVING IT TO YOU I DON'T KNOW WHY OUR SVC HQS ARE NOT TAKING IT. DEFENCE OFFICERS STATUS HAS TO BE RESTORED AND CONCERTED EFFORTS ARE REQUIRED FROM ALL OF US TOWARDS THIS CAUSE. LETS NOT PUT OBSTACLES AND SET ASIDE NARROW MINDED NESS. PAY AND STATUS IS IMPORTANT TO EVERY INDIVIDUAL AND WE IN DEF FORCES ARE no DIFFERENT AND MOREOVER WHAT WE ARE ASKING IS OUR RIGHT ONLY & NOTHING ELSE.Satishnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-36459439416133349562009-12-25T13:22:06.524+05:302009-12-25T13:22:06.524+05:30After having gone through this very interesting de...After having gone through this very interesting debate on the subject very dear to all of us one aspect which is precipitating for sure is the lack of mutual respect and hence indifference to mutual progression. Every one up the ladder misses no chance to prove that he is different. The worst is when most of the people up the ladder start dissociating with the peers. It is evidently clear from above comments that we are all with still minds. We are far too vigorously contending the progression of our on cadre instead of challenging the degradation inflicted on us. All those part of Paramilitary forces and GP 'A' services have been pushed up by one grade and hence effectively we have been pushed down by one grade. If by their up gradation the world did not collapse than why are so many outcries against only a thought/preposition pertaining to our own growth. It only reflects our constipated and confined attitude. The states have so many DGPs but none of their cadre officers are displaying our type of thinking to say the least. It’s high time that we find ways and means to change ourselves and ensure every one gets adequately compensated in terms of his status too. The outside world doesn’t care two hoots about us since the ranks of our's are really of no consequence to them. However this obsession of ours with Rum, Ribbons and Ranks have been nicely used against us by the beurocrats and hence proved that we ourselves are our best enemies. Rightly said it is we who are regressive and rightfully responsible for our own state of affairs. Dear Navdeep Sir, I know you to be of a very progressive mind set however after these arguments put fwd by you I can only remind you of a good old historical reality…….. “You too Brutus”. Pardon me for my words.<br /><br />With Regards<br />RajAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-466195460663986182009-12-24T23:15:52.391+05:302009-12-24T23:15:52.391+05:30I wonder why every officer should aspire to be the...I wonder why every officer should aspire to be the COAS and place himself in that stupid pyramid? Why should a creative genius who may be lacking the qualities of a commander ever want to be part of such a race? Would he not be more satisfied and happy with a job which is more to his liking? Is it success that is key to happiness, or vice versa?<br /><br />If promotion is still a big issue, why can’t we have several pyramids – the gradient will be much less steep. Each pyramid catering to different categories (aptitudes) of officers. We may need to expand the no of specialist fields.Pied Pipernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-90604863603808787192009-12-24T21:25:51.532+05:302009-12-24T21:25:51.532+05:30dear navdeep ,
the time of col(ts) should be at 20...dear navdeep ,<br />the time of col(ts) should be at 20/21 yrs.kds khurananoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-65947633361775234132009-12-24T15:50:29.707+05:302009-12-24T15:50:29.707+05:30When armed forces lost miserably on parity issue i...When armed forces lost miserably on parity issue in pay commission, why cry foul over the "Consolation Prize" the Govt is contemplating to Lt Cols? Only because there is going to be too much red? Its nothing more than a mental block which was manifested when full-sleeves of OG uniform were shortened or majors were made lt cols at 13 years. good thing is its only a matter of time we get over it.<br />18 years, today, may seem too early today. But five years down the lane, we may repent having it extended to 20, 21, 22 or 23 years wen we may have to knock ministry's doors to reduce it back to 18 years owing to growing displeasure over parity issue.<br />If we don't have strength enough to fight for what we want, at least we should have humility enough to accept what we getAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-53587772657338337022009-12-24T14:05:18.048+05:302009-12-24T14:05:18.048+05:30This remark on why get touchy about red tabs is ri...This remark on why get touchy about red tabs is right on. If a Security agency were to give their Guards red tabs - imagine how the red tabs would feel when they pass by. <br />AND no one in the Army HQ will even raise a peep to ensure that such degardation is stopped.<br />W.r.t CG officers we are to blame.We use such organisations as dumping grounds and choice postings. Hence neither the offr on deputation nor the organisation is bothered about parity.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-61401194582945137482009-12-24T13:11:55.895+05:302009-12-24T13:11:55.895+05:30Dear All,
We all join the Services for reasons in...Dear All,<br /><br />We all join the Services for reasons including for the glamour of the Uniform and that of Gorgets. <br /><br />Alas, The Police forces have reduced the glamour of uniform and Tabs to rubbles. They jeliously and unmindfully put the tabs, stars and Georgets (silk) on every ones throat.<br /><br />The condition of status by the Pay was thrust on the systems by IAS as they had very fast grade / appontment progression. That led the Police services also to achive similar rank / grade progression and equate themselves with Generals.<br /><br />These two so called elite services (IAS and IPS) have pushed every other down in their blind elitist competition with IAS emerging as winner, IPS running behind and all others after them. <br /><br />It becomes essential for the second runger IPS and IFS (Foreign Service)to stay at second postion for which they per force need to push Armed Forces much down and satisfy their "staus needs" and enjoy the sadistic pleasure.<br /><br />In this elitist competition, essentially "Indian" in nature and essence, Armed Forces have lost out as the Armed Forces are not Political Instruments like IAS and IPS. They are not Finacial instrument. And alas! who cares for the populace, the country and security. The permanent institutions (IAS, IFS and IPS) are busy pulling down their own Armed Forces in blind rage to satisfy their hunger for status by "putting the general in his place" (the famous MoD liner used even by a peon there).<br /><br />Hence The question of status and Pay progression needs to be delinked completely from the civilians and police. Status of Armed Forces should be restored to post indepence postion. Pay fixation and grade Pay to be reasonably higher than civilians and same progression.<br /><br />The status must continue to remain based on ranks as existing before First Pay Commission.<br /><br />That is what USA and other western democracies are following.<br /><br />We need to be national "Armed Forces" that belong to the people and their leaders rather than being equated with the irresponsible and anti-people bearuacrates and colonial style Police Forces. Armed Forces can not afford to be seen and get discreditted like them.<br /><br />That is the only way Armed Forces can maintain their "Izzat and Iqbal". Otherwise these competing elites in their blind rat race will so demoralise the Armed Forces that there would be no requirement for external agression to defeat Indian Armed Forces and demoralise them.<br /><br />Let us go "out of the box" and allow them to box each other rather than the winners and losers boxing the Armed Forces in frustration.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-38579934643269908252009-12-24T11:42:04.194+05:302009-12-24T11:42:04.194+05:30KRoy said
"Now in 6th pay commission Comman...KRoy said <br /><br />"Now in 6th pay commission Commandants Grade Pay has become Rs 8700 and now equated with Capt in Navy with Grade Pay Rs 8700."<br /><br />We can actually rejoice now that CG intake is higher than the Naval intake. 78 guys in the last batch. Nation's youth knows where the money, pride and honor lies.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-11865818649974498252009-12-24T11:41:22.087+05:302009-12-24T11:41:22.087+05:30IT IS INCREDIBLE TO SEE THAT THERE ARE OPPONENTS T...IT IS INCREDIBLE TO SEE THAT THERE ARE OPPONENTS TO THE "PARITY SEEKERS". AND THAT INCLUDES MAJ NAVDEEP. AS BROUGHT OUT BY kroy, THE COAST GUARD COMMANDANTS WHO WERE EARLIER BELOW MAJORS IN PAY ARE NOW ON PARITY WITH FULL COLS IN GRADE PAY OF 8700.<br /><br />THERE IS NO WAY THAT RANK WILL BE DE-LINKED FROM PAY / GRADE PAY AND WE WILL CONTINUE TO LOSE OUT TO EVERY SERVICE WITH EVERY PAY COMMISSION.<br /><br />THERE IS NO ALTERNATIVE BUT TO PROMOTE OFFICERS TO COLONEL AND BRIGADIER ON A REDUCED TIME BASIS LIKE 18-19 AND 24-25 FOR BRIGADIER. SELECTION CAN BE DONE FROM THESE COLONELS AND BRIGS FOR OPERATIONAL APPOINTMENTS / COURSES WHICH WILL CLEAR THEIR WAY FOR FURTHER PROMOTIONS. <br /><br />WE MUST QUICKLY SHED THIS TIGHT ASSED APPROACH OF CLAIMING TO BE THE PRESERVERS OF GORGET PURITY. NO CIVILIAN CARES ABOUT THE GARNISHES ON YOUR UNIFORM AND BRAIDS ON UR CAPS. THEY ARE QUICK TO CLAIM THAT THEY'RE GP IS HIGHER AND HENCE THEY ARE SENIOR. THIS IS AN EVERYDAY HAPPENING. ONE LOOK AT THE ESTATES POLICY OF ALLOTMENT OF HOUSE TELLS ALL. <br />ONLY A MAJ GEN AND ABOVE (GP OF Rs 10,000/) CAN GET TYPE VI ACCOMODATION WHICH A LT COL OF BASIC PAY OF 18,000 AND ABOVE USED TO GET.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-69704326233128863782009-12-24T06:22:08.073+05:302009-12-24T06:22:08.073+05:30email comments.kojakemail comments.kojakkopterkojakhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18446617907720033084noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-57001616853634782472009-12-24T06:20:30.580+05:302009-12-24T06:20:30.580+05:30Damm good wk navdip.got yrs thru col HS"Harry...Damm good wk navdip.got yrs thru col HS"Harry "Ahuja.The yard stick for parity must be fine tuned.I understand my old schoolmate(Cottons)Gen"Timmy" never bent on this issue.(Read also spies in the mountains).In my dads ww2 time, rapid acting ranks were done when req.in 1991-92 when on the faculty of the NDC i saw an amazing thing.The seniormost was a 28 yrs Air Cmde.next Brig with 25 or 24 yrs.next commodore 21 yrs.ALL OTHERS were max 18 yrs incl me as a faculty wg cdr.Ifs, Ias, ips and obscure audit etc services, rly board lady etc.Angle for parity at the NDC.regards kojak(Wg Cdr KJ"Kojak"Bhatt(Visit at Youtube.com/kopterkojak for my music incl soldier.)kopterkojakhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18446617907720033084noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-28132001608400843772009-12-23T23:03:30.491+05:302009-12-23T23:03:30.491+05:30If we want to remain combat ready, let's not h...If we want to remain combat ready, let's not have anymore upgradation of ranks. In fact, in a few years, we will possibly have to accept reducing the flab gathering on top. If you havn't made it, just go out and be happy. There is enough opportunity for the brave to do so.<br />Brig SK ChatterjiSK Chatterjihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05420151487044348877noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-5508748035724390612009-12-23T14:07:02.082+05:302009-12-23T14:07:02.082+05:30Compare the increase of so called collar tabs -jus...Compare the increase of so called collar tabs -just verify with Coast Guard ,now even Commandant puts it with GP Rs 8700.If history is checked Commandants were junior by one increment till 4 th Pay commission with Lt Cdr of Navy basic pay (Rs 3600 +Rs 600=Rs 4200) and Commandants basic was Rs 4100.In 5th Pay Commission Commandants basic was Rs 14300 and was compared with Cdr whose basic was Rs 13500+Rs 1600 Rank pay=Rs 15100.Now in 6th pay commission Commandants Grade Pay has become Rs 8700 and now equated with Capt in Navy with Grade Pay Rs 8700.<br />Such glaring disparity will definitely effect operations where various inter services joint operations are conducted.<br />Solution is to bring back parity even if that means more collar tabs officer in services.We should not only see intra organizaion fall out etc,we need to take holistic view as well -what is external environment vis a vis where we are placed.If today this cadre review correction is not done than in future will come Mag Gen and higher ups may be equated with say Commandant etc as the trend going. We should not live in well only,need to study macro environment as well to be in high morale .We need to be open and ready for changes as todays buzz word is innovation and managing changes.KRoynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-74010313602556282462009-12-23T12:53:10.362+05:302009-12-23T12:53:10.362+05:30Dear Maj Navdeep,
TOO MANY RED TABS is definite...Dear Maj Navdeep,<br /><br /> TOO MANY RED TABS is definitely sad but it must be viewed and evaluated based on the dynamics around you to realize that it is necessary.<br /> The rules of the game have been set by the Politicians and the IAS.<br /> The has to be played and must be played as per the new rules framed.<br /> NO ONE SHOULD GRUDGE THE INCREASE IN THE NUMBER OF RED TABS NOW.Pawannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-63484071444251751692009-12-23T11:16:33.613+05:302009-12-23T11:16:33.613+05:30LOOK WITH OPEN-MINDED APPROACH AND THE WAY THINGS ...LOOK WITH OPEN-MINDED APPROACH AND THE WAY THINGS ARE IN THE COUNTRY ;OTHER GP A/CL-1 services. ARMED FORCES CANNOT (indian citizens) BE TREATED IN DIFFERENT WAY.THEREFORE-<br /> 1.delink pay from rank.<br /> 2.what is so great about gorgets/ tabs?????? every one in some foreign armies wears them.<br /> 3.in USA a sgt gets higher pay than an officer.thus an officer with more svc can get higher pay than an officer of higher rk with less svc.<br />4.NFFG has to be in AF,otherwise the AF and the country has to live with deficiencies and poor quality intake.<br />5.retaining officers with no avenues of progression ,keep using them as bonded labour is inhuman and crime.release them with an offer of a reasonable package ; yes they were duly inducted with all those high QRs and they maintain profile of fitness and efficiancy.they should not be used as rk fodder to service the rank structure.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com