tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post2703420811301772211..comments2024-02-08T22:01:40.101+05:30Comments on Indian Military : Service Benefits and Issues: The (mis)interpreters at the office of DGAFMS strike again : act in absolute contravention of Army Order and Presidential sanctionNavdeep / Maj Navdeep Singhhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11481215977936848477noreply@blogger.comBlogger54125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-36516739898607492272010-07-02T07:33:55.712+05:302010-07-02T07:33:55.712+05:30theres a Q as to why docs get NPA - the simple ans...theres a Q as to why docs get NPA - the simple answer is - he studied when you enjoyed. Besides it may be better to allow them to practice - especially in remote areas as they will benefit the locals and they will get richer - any doc worth his salt will earn more if allowed to practice in non working hours than the measly 25% NPAAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-63940261849843434342009-03-12T16:09:00.000+05:302009-03-12T16:09:00.000+05:30Hi NavdeeppLEASE EDUCATE these jokers in DGAFMS Df...Hi Navdeep<BR/>pLEASE EDUCATE these jokers in DGAFMS Dfence that SSC, EC Non pensioner officers are far far better and done lot of sacrifices while in service than wives, children, parents of pensioner service officer who are now getting ECHS facilities. They are parasites and bleed defence profusely as ever. <BR/>Can not these duds differentiate and accept immediately ECHS benefit for released officers with good conduct. I am sure they deserve the most than these dependents of ECHS officers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-60888855432947867312009-03-12T16:01:00.000+05:302009-03-12T16:01:00.000+05:30Dear Navdeep,Please see to it that Army --in parti...Dear Navdeep,<BR/>Please see to it that Army --in particular DGAFMS does not deny medical faciilities entitled to released SSC and Ec and officers of 19 years service.<BR/>Youngsters..I warn that they should not join Army..it is treating released officers in a most shabby manner.Why would anyone serve army in these terms and get injured or die when a civilian-- wife,parents or children<BR/>get the ECHS benefit.<BR/>Generals seem to have no idea of anamoly in this stupid systems...can any one particularly Maj Navdeep inform thro your access that SSC EC or other19 years served officers have done much more sacrifice while in service than the ECHS officer's wife,children,parents.<BR/>For God sake let COAS at Army HQ immediately act on it lest I am going public about the serious lapses and advantage being a wife, child, parent of retired officer than serving in Army as SSC officer. For Gods sake treat them gracefully as they served the nation for full contract term and they are to be given perks like pensioner...even if that comes to delinking dependents. <BR/><BR/>Navdeep please take this up soon....I will second you for filing this case in High court Best LUck......arjunUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07929398137305439326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-71147493293559969712009-03-09T16:31:00.000+05:302009-03-09T16:31:00.000+05:30ya this idea is good People are getting dependent...ya this idea is good <BR/><BR/>People are getting dependent cards for canteen <BR/><BR/>we should check same for medical entitlement also<BR/><BR/>so easyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-77148761874551020582009-03-09T16:29:00.000+05:302009-03-09T16:29:00.000+05:30dear anonymous it will be appreciated atleast u ca...dear anonymous it will be appreciated atleast u can tell your designation if not your name rather then just being anonymous.<BR/><BR/>u are absolutely right recently a CO came to me for treatment of his mother in law who was given a maid servent pass ( a maid servent is entitled opd consultation only if pass is made from adm comdt and pass is valid only till posting of officer in stn and only for lifethreathening illnesses for immediate problems) <BR/><BR/>pleople do missuse things at senior levels and when we try to be strict they complain.. well we have to be stern at such stray incidences which we come across and i dont see rank at that time...wrong means wrong.. i brought it to notice of adm comdt but actually nothing happened..<BR/>i guess wrong deeds of AMC people gets glorified and projected and echoed repeatedly and NON AMC guys wrong deeds are supressed at various levels...cant change the system can we?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-9917872951984512482009-03-09T02:44:00.000+05:302009-03-09T02:44:00.000+05:30Dear Navdeep,I wonder if you are aware of the prob...Dear Navdeep,<BR/><BR/>I wonder if you are aware of the problem of fake dependent cards being issued at unit level. There is absolutely no control over number of dependent cards issued to serving soldiers. There have been cases where one person has been found to have 15-20 dependent cards.<BR/>These cards have been used for CSD facilities & MH facilities commonly. The misuse in CSD has stopped by introduction of Smart cards. Why can't we have same smart cards used in hospitals too for identification? This will bring down the number of people in wards & OPDs of military hospitals by as much percentage as fall in CSD sales after introduction of smart cards. <BR/>The Powers-that-be do seem to listen to issues raised in this forum. Why don't you raise this issue of fake dependent cards too in this e-forum? If somebody does indeed take some action, it would be good for all the patients as they will get more time from the doctors, nurses & other AMC staff.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-87189281460823287082009-03-08T06:26:00.000+05:302009-03-08T06:26:00.000+05:30Dear LIVE LIFE,IMHO,AMC is not targeting any speci...Dear LIVE LIFE,<BR/><BR/>IMHO,AMC is not targeting any specific category- Ex-servicemen or serving.<BR/>I think what AMC is fighting about is to stop addition of dependent population without addition of manpower and infrastructure. It has been happening for the last couple of decades without bothering about additional manpower/infrastructure required. It needed a few brave souls in DGAFMS office to finally put their foot down. Unfortunately, the latest category being added was this class of ex-servicemen at that time. <BR/>We can only hope it works out well to satisfaction of all. I still don't understand why released/retired SS & EC officers are not allowed to be members of ECHS, while making them entitled to treatment in MHs? What's the catch there? <BR/><BR/>ALL PARTICIPANTS HERE CAN HELP IN A BIG WAY. It is very common for people to have 15-20 dependent cards in case of serving people. There is simply no check in the units for the number of dependent cards being issued out. Once a person joins the fauj, he has a dependent card for his/her own family, in-laws, cousins, nephews, nieces, neighbours etc etc. All of them become entitled to the care in MH by virtue of that card. <BR/>If we have a smart card like the CSD is implementing (Use the same one for hospitals also), you will be surprised by the decrease in crowds at the military hospitals (Just like what happened at CSDs). So let's start setting our own house in order!!! Just ensure adequate control on issuing dependent cards in your units. Don't be so blindly welfare oriented.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-77549994026366646282009-03-05T18:22:00.000+05:302009-03-05T18:22:00.000+05:30Am an EX AMC SS Officer, when I applied for Medica...Am an EX AMC SS Officer, when I applied for Medical Entitlement Card it was refused by MPRS(O)/DGMS(ARMY)saying that non pensioners are not entitled for any treatment at MH. What should I do now?bashhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09423585915059941440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-85875697533472859002009-03-05T15:11:00.000+05:302009-03-05T15:11:00.000+05:30well well.... understood sir!! u all guys are very...well well.... understood sir!! u all guys are very hard pressed for manpower, same goes for the rest of the fauj...isn't it.So crux of the discussion going on since quite a few days should end here with a resolute to aid all the support to the AMC for having their auth strength increaseda nd so should the infrastructure in all the MHs. With the ever increasing load on the MHs it is imperative that both manpower and strength of AMC be increased manifold as per their requirement. We all are here to support u in ur fight for the same but please for god's sake don't target the ESMs and SS lot only... be impartial and keep the standards of ur duty as high as it has been in the past. God Speed!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-64121169561104438232009-03-05T12:22:00.000+05:302009-03-05T12:22:00.000+05:30What was started by Maj Navdeep as a debate on ent...What was started by Maj Navdeep as a debate on entitlement for medical treatment in MH between two subsets of our veterans,(pensioners vs non pensioners) has been converted into a no holds barred slugfest between another two subsets of our serving officers. (AMC vs non AMC)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-76917266725134689722009-03-05T01:08:00.000+05:302009-03-05T01:08:00.000+05:30Dear AMC guys, I did not know there were so many ...Dear AMC guys,<BR/> I did not know there were so many pessimists amongst us. I only hope SSB is doing its job sincerely.<BR/> <BR/> AMC is doing a wonderfull job. They are as good as the best if not better (barring small percentage). Hence they deserve much more than they have been given.<BR/><BR/> Majority of us do not mind the extra perks given to them. So do not bother for some bloggers who seem to be plain saddists.<BR/><BR/> I am not a medico.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-11038706773901282362009-03-04T12:52:00.000+05:302009-03-04T12:52:00.000+05:30Carrying the argument of optimum ratios further, l...Carrying the argument of optimum ratios further, let us have a doctor: dependent population ratio of 1:1000 (Something like equivalent of a battalion). Developed countries have a ratio of close to 1:240-250 and still claim shortage of doctors. <BR/><BR/>This ratio should include the specialists also. With a dependent population of at least 2 crores (Including serving, ESM, families as well as released SS & EC officers), we would need at least 20000 medical officers to look after 2 crore people. Present strength of around 4000 is inadequate even for the serving soldiers and their families!!!<BR/>With specialists doing daily/alternate call duties in busy hospitals, the fatigue sets in too. After all you can't keep fighting forever!!!<BR/>The solution to all the complaints is increasing the sanctioned number of medical officers. It is so glaringly obvious, but who will bell the cat?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-5061169850398953492009-03-04T11:45:00.000+05:302009-03-04T11:45:00.000+05:30It has been very educative to follow the comments ...It has been very educative to follow the comments on this particular post. <BR/>Firstly, I must thank all the comment authors for their frank views about this eye-opener on the majority view about AMC. Reading these can bring one down to mother earth fairly quickly.<BR/>I am a medical officer pursuing super-speciality training at a considerable expense of personal savings with the desire of excelling at what we do just like so many of my senior stalwarts. It can be highly demotivating if this is what the clientele thinks about already stretched out AMC. Would it have been wiser to just earn the higher grade pay & let my skills rust at the levels commensurate with the opinion of the clientele? I think the answer remains a firm "No" to that. But will I remain as motivated as before after reading all this. Unfortunately, the answer remains "No" to this too.<BR/>As far as I remember, all the orders about entitlements are decided by the AG's branch mostly. DGAFMS can only interpret them. <BR/><BR/>I think it would be good step to decide what is the optimum Doctor: dependent population ratio for the Armed Forces. Let that be decided by the AG's office or whosoever COAS deems fit to do so. The approximate dependent population is probably more than a couple of crores including ESM and families. AMC has around 4000 medical oficers including all specialists as well as RMOs. Determine what is the additional requirement of medical officers, commission as many doctors (preferably specialists, as they are in high demand and it takes 3 years to train one). If AMC still can't do the job it is expected to do, it is only then anyone has right to complain. It doesn't make any sense that every few years, a few lakhs are added to the clientele with no additional man power.<BR/><BR/> It can't go on forever like that!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-87248078682935648792009-03-01T17:11:00.000+05:302009-03-01T17:11:00.000+05:30Dear Fellow men in uniform,,,,,,,,Plz for heaven s...Dear Fellow men in uniform,,,,,,,,Plz for heaven sake stop taking things to ur heart and fighting amongst ourselves.What maj Navdeep brought out was a matter of all of us to discuss on and arrive at a positive solution.Here we have doctors and non doctors of the same fraternity going hammer and tongs at each other!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<BR/><BR/> I am not a Doc and there have been times when I have cursed the Naval Hospitals for the long queue.But after an interaction with one Medical Officer,I started viewing things from a slightly different perspective.The Docs are stretched thin and this is a fact.But at the same time,denying patients their treatment is not correct at all.<BR/><BR/> Let's have a healthy discussion here rather than the Doctors feeling they are being targetted unfairly.At the same time the comments of some Medical Officers make one feel that they are the most victimised sections of the society.Plz try and put forth ur point across with some civility and let's see what the solution is!!!!!!!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-70885066351987466772009-03-01T09:03:00.000+05:302009-03-01T09:03:00.000+05:30I think all of us got diverted from main issue.Wh...I think all of us got diverted from main issue.When govt. was keeping mum on PB 4 all of us had "common enemy".Now that issue is sorted out.Now we developed "Fingeritis" to some sections of our own people.<BR/> One question I would like to ask to those who are arguiing against AMC_ Do you or your relatives would like to get admitted in a ward which is overburdened with patients or to a hospital with optimum bed occupancy?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-76203181965427324442009-03-01T00:21:00.000+05:302009-03-01T00:21:00.000+05:30Great…! AMC is part of the MoD but not of the Ar...Great…! AMC is part of the MoD but not of the Army(Whose part is the Army anyway. MoD sees it as principal enemy to be smashed in to smithereens). <BR/><BR/> Then why do the AMC wear Army uniforms and ranks? Why blame COAS for DAPC/ No DAPC(In place of MSP & NPA?) issue if you are not part of his organization?<BR/><BR/>The MHs are too crowded to look after the ESM / their entitled families but very cozy for treating cronies from MoD though not entitled. <BR/> <BR/>One suggestion. Reinforce ECHS and widen its scope. Detach it from military hospitals and its bureaucracy. Let it be available through accredited reputed hospitals which are plenty in this country. Spare ESM the agony of being insulted by the organization they served (May excuse the ESM for the ignorance of assuming that MHs are part the organization they once served and cherish that memory with pride).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-31101812759573603632009-02-28T23:33:00.000+05:302009-02-28T23:33:00.000+05:30Hi LIVE LIFE.I feel sorry to read that you call su...Hi LIVE LIFE.<BR/>I feel sorry to read that you call such an important matter as "cock and bull story". Firstly I am on call 24h a day already on ground, for the army and at night I sit on blog when there is no call pending. <BR/>Secondly let me give you a real life experience. I went on a TD to Bagdogra MH where a lot of Gorkha ESM come from across Nepal. In addition guys and families from air force station come over. The medical OPD for PBOR is only on two days a week as fixed by the stn HQ in consultation with MH. On my first OPD I saw a crowd of 100 -120 patients. I said no hassles, I am on TD, staying in the mess next door, plus I am normally on fast on a tuesday so no problem of going for a lunch break. I started at 10 am (from 8 am to 10 am you are supposed to finish off your ICU and ward rounds), and even if you give just 4 to 5 min to a patient, please calculate how much time it will take to dispose off 120 patients. Any way at 6pm I got up from my chair and after taking my evening ward round went back to the mess pretty satisfied at 7.30pm. Guess what happened the next day? The CO of MH Bagdogra fired me that why I made a Gorkha ESM wait upto 6 pm? He missed his last bus and had to sleep overnight somewhere. When I told him there were 120 patients, and someone had to be first and someone the last, he told me that the previous doctor (who had left the army after his SS tenure, and in whose place I had come on TD) used to finish off all his OPD 120 or 150 by 1.30 pm and be back in mess. The next day the nursing asst told me the secret- he too initially used to see each patient individually. Then he realised that the Gorkha ESM will keep on coming in bunches all the time, so he would call 4 -5 together at a time give them a common prescription, ask them to divide the medicines among themselves. Dont you think this eyewash is the result of our system bieng overstreched? After all who are we fooling around with?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-19523287691086964192009-02-28T21:20:00.000+05:302009-02-28T21:20:00.000+05:30Hey man! Medical specialist. I hope you are not se...Hey man! Medical specialist. I hope you are not serious about what you said about bieng disenchanted by blogger's comments. All of us work to satisfy our professional self, not for some opinion poll. As my boss out here in CMC keeps on saying- we are not in hotel service to satisfy customer's demands; we are in a hospital service to satisfy our professional quest so that the patient gets the most scientific and appropriate treatment. <BR/>The comments by various people are their own views and they have a right to have one. It only displays their depth of ignorance. You know, when the 26/11 encounter in Mumbai was on, and we all know our guys out there did a thorough professional job, my civilian collegues out here kept on bugging me ( as if I am a rep of the Indian army ) as to why 400 commandos took 4 days to capture/ neutralise 4 terrorists? How did 10 terrorist in a fishing trawl sneak past a navy with aircraft carriers and nuclear submarines? It was their ignorance on military matters which allows them to raise such doubts. Similar is the scene out here.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-72336594902334960972009-02-28T17:46:00.000+05:302009-02-28T17:46:00.000+05:30i think the bloggers here doent even know the basi...i think the bloggers here doent even know the basics about AMC..<BR/><BR/>the specialist are most sort after in any hospital and after resonable sevice everyone likes to leave its so lucrative outside. but army laches on to us and doesnt allow anaesthetist, medical spl and surgeon to leave. for a superspecialist a premature release is a dream come true.<BR/><BR/>and well if u guys dont appreciate the work we do u really dont deserve us. <BR/><BR/>and mind u its the army (coas) who is not increasing the strength of paramedics and doctors.. so how do u expect better services by just increasing dependancy day by day on MH. ya someone rightly said one day we too will become like muncipal corporation hospital with overflow of patients on to floors then it will be too late a wake up call.<BR/><BR/>what ever COAS and DGAMS does is out of experience and not by ignorance. the know best what is good and bad for army.. leave the thinking for them. <BR/><BR/>A young captian in battle field ..does he ask 10 questions to CO. before carrying out a order... well the answer is no. since his boss knows what is best for the unit. we look from a narrow angle the CO looks from a wider prospective but for COAS and DGAFMS they have to consider much beyound army and its implications for future too so leave the policy decisions for them ....dont show your narrow minded biting attitute or rather cribbing attitude to any services<BR/><BR/>after reading this blog i know exactly what u guys think of AMC haha u made me a highy dedicated guy towards army into a guy who resents army now ..what the ... am i toiling hard day in and night for these fools who just like cribbing..<BR/><BR/>got some real introspection to do now.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-29143221443833932632009-02-27T23:31:00.000+05:302009-02-27T23:31:00.000+05:30well all the cock and bull story again... please i...well all the cock and bull story again... please if someone is listening sort out the problems of AMC at the earliest so that the doctor on call is readily available on ground and not on this blog only ...for all of us here and let them honour at least the COAS by not floating letters on their own... if not the fauj as a whole. At least the org will benefit...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-38188166051407437362009-02-27T19:46:00.000+05:302009-02-27T19:46:00.000+05:30as stated by some body on 25Feb 1.58 pm, please gi...as stated by some body on 25Feb 1.58 pm, please give details of MoD letter granting OPD facilities to non pensioner ex-servicemen in AFCs/MHs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-36376678541987799142009-02-27T12:38:00.000+05:302009-02-27T12:38:00.000+05:30live LIFE is either too busy to read the ongoing d...live LIFE is either too busy to read the ongoing discussion on this issue or he is merely casual in his approach to such an important topic.<BR/>Many doctors including some super specialists have made this point amply clear that AMC does not care whether SS officers come for treatment or regular officers or families or even parents ( as in ECHS). The whole point is are we ready to cope up with this type of load with entitlement and scales made in 1970 based on requirement of that time. Do we want to make MHs also like municipal hospitals with people lying on floors because there is no space to accomodate everyone who comes there for treatment? A nurse can ideally see 10 - 15 patients during a night shift duty. Already in some busy MHs there is one nurse at night to look after a medical or surgical ward with 40 -45 patients. <BR/>Why isnt the focus of the bloggers going towards raising their collective voices to increase manpower ( all levels - doctors, nurses, nursing assistants, laboratory staff, even safai walas) and resources ( medicines, life saving equipments, hi tech gadgets) so that every army person serving or retired, SS or regular, pensioner or not, be treated in MHs as a RIGHT and not as an adjustment or favour.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-85649813673523053852009-02-27T11:45:00.000+05:302009-02-27T11:45:00.000+05:30This one is for LIVE LIFE.It's time to look wi...This one is for LIVE LIFE.<BR/><BR/>It's time to look within. Everyone is doing their job, or at least supposedly doing so. As far as treating patients is concerned, AMC is doing a reasonably good job. If you can't appreciate it, don't resent it.<BR/> As about having enough number of patients, you have just exposed your ignorance about the size of the problem here. With all the SS officers & their families becoming entitled, the entitled population is going to not only increase, it's going to multiply. The number of medical personnel still remains the same.<BR/> Everyone desires specialist treatment/ treatment by a doctor only, even if all that is required is a first aid dressing. All efforts are made to meet the expectations. The number of doctors is extremely limited & specialists even more so. Still we continue to waste our doctors and specialists' skills in peripheral locations instead of strengthening the evacuation means. <BR/>I & so many other colleagues have spent months sitting in locations where the average sick report for a couple of months is equivalent to 30 minutes of work in an average MH.<BR/><BR/>Another issue which you mentioned was QUITTING. You probably didn't even notice that AMC officers probably have the highest rejection rate of resignation papers. The people who are waiting in the wings to join the fauj who were not really very successful in civil stream (Reasons- ?Lack of required skills?). You want those folks? By all means have them! Let the current AMC folks go & you'll know what you are missing out on. Any specialist who has managed to quit prematurely has done extremely well in the civil scene. So don't increase the pre-existing resentment by offering such comments.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-75793249801241454222009-02-27T08:17:00.000+05:302009-02-27T08:17:00.000+05:30annon@6.26 pmand yours is wishful thinking/heresay...annon@6.26 pm<BR/>and yours is wishful thinking/heresay or plain sarcasm?!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1503293844377013031.post-38913273265817707122009-02-26T21:16:00.000+05:302009-02-26T21:16:00.000+05:30Thanx maj navdeep for bringing to light such an is...Thanx maj navdeep for bringing to light such an issue which has been raked up By the DGAFMS.C'mon wake up all of u guys.. why should the DGAFMS be given the right to float such policy letters and that too without the knowledge of COAS. Secondly can anyone in AMC explain that does the bullet being fired at own troops distinguish amongst SS and regular offrs? It doesn't!!! then who the ... are u to do so. Secondly it exposes our fauj's bias towards regular offrs. The records of last three yrs can be taken into account which clearly indicates that more than 80% offrs who laid down teir lives while fighting Terrorists in J& k and NE were SS offrs then Who The .. is DGAFMS to issue such biased orders. AS far as treating patients is concerned its their job and they re being paid for it... and moreover they get NPA for getting less amount of practice while in army.... Now that they've got enough no of patients to treat the govt should might as well should do away with their NPA.And people who dont agree are welcome to quit. Let me tel u gentlemen there's no dearth of people wanting to join as doctors in army.. so please leave us for the better of our Army. Remember AMC guys u re here to serve the army and not the other way round.And it goes for all other arms and services as well!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com